Window Screeching or Grinding

[PoetAtLaw]

Hello, Everyone. I have a 2002 Blackbird with about 46,000 miles. Today I noticed a screeching, grinding sound when I roll my driver's side window up or down. The sound is similar to what one would expect if dirt or gravel fell inside the door assembly and against the window, but I have no reason to believe such a thing happened. Moreover, my car has suffered no recent trauma of which I am aware (although just a day before the strange sounds began the dealership replaced the clock spring in my steering wheel column assembly when my airbag light came on.) Has anyone had experience with strange window noises? Thanks in advance for your help!

[George]

Welcome poet!
I had not heard of this happening on a TBird before, but would suspect that possibly something happened at your dealers. Of course there's no way to prove or disprove that.
On another note, please explain the symtoms you had before they replaced the clockspring. Did your radio controls fail??

[00mustng]

....I had my clock spring replaced as well....as a result of the airbag icon coming on...and subsequent diagnostic. As it was explained to me, if the airbag icon is on, the airbags won't deploy in an accident. ....so $400.00cdn. later...

[PoetAtLaw]

Hi, George. The clock spring problem is a long story. The problem was diagnosed by the dealership when the airbag light remained on.

The dealership wanted to $95 just to diagnose the problem, but "kindly" offered to deduct the cost from the repair. The estimated repair cost was about $580, of which $112 was the part cost. The dealership also indicated the airbag light could be caused by a problem with the airbag mechanism itself, too, and they wouldn't know for certain until they repaired the clock spring. The airbag fix was estimated to cost $860. The amount seemed a shockingly high (but I am no car-repair expert). So I called a few non-dealerships. Each quoted a price, including parts, of less than $200.00.

When I confronted the dealership about the amazing cost disparity, the service manager indicated the T-Bird's telescoping steering wheel added time to the repair, and the standard, computerized time-estimators didn't include that cost. (Frankly, I was skeptical, because I had discussed the complexity of the steering column with some of the other repair shops, and one shop owner had fixed three Ford clock springs that week, but not T-Bird clock springs.)

Of course, the dealership had a deal for me! The dealership noted I had not done my 30,000 mile servicing at the dealership. (I had done it through Jiffy Lube.) So they offered to do the servicing for (coincidentally) about the same amount as the clock spring repair ($570). In exchange, they would fix the clock spring at no charge and make any necessary repairs to the airbag at no charge. The servicing included all new filters, all new fluids, flushing all systems, rotating tires -- a fine list of services. My T-Bird now has about 47,000 miles, so I didn't mind another round of servicing, given the specialized knowledge (theoretically) of the dealership, if the price were reasonable.

The dealership further indicated that Ford likes loyal owners, that having the servicing done at the dealership would show loyalty, and that the loyalty would be rewarded if in the future I had serious problems. The dealership and Ford would be more willing to cover a new transmission under an elective warranty fix, for example, if I showed my loyalty.

So I trusted the dearlership and had the repair done. Of course, the repair took an extra day and they neglected to deduct the $95 diagnostic fee, which I brought to their attention. But as far as I know the work was completed.

HOWEVER, today I received a call back from another Ford dealership I contacted prior to my repair. Their estimate for the clock spring? Not the $580 estimated by my dealership. Instead, it was FOUR HUNDRED DOLLARS less. The estimate was about $200, just like the non-Ford repair shops. So I called five additional Ford dearlerships. Each one quoted a parts-and-labor cost of between $200 and $250!!

I am shocked and mortified by the dishonesty of the dealership. I am equally shocked by their gall at overcharging me even after I brought the concern to their attention, even after advising them I am an attorney.

Naturally, I have a call in to all levels of management above the service department. Any suggestions about what would be a fair settlement and what further action you recommend would be appreciated.

[George]

That is quite a story. I'm sure you'll do what you have to to get them to make it right. However, it appears as though you gave them the opportunity to service the car properly. Maybe it's time to elevate the entire sequence to Ford Customer Service, with a copy to the dealers owner/President. Just a thought.
BTW, clocksprings are not new to us. There have been a few that have posted their issues, in earlier times, here.

[PoetAtLaw]

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UPDATE: I contacted the assistant general manager at the dealership. He was very concerned about my experience with the clock spring and contacted the service manager who had convinced me to take the $570 package of services. The assistant manager was on vacation, but the assistant general manager was concerned enough to have him contact me from vacation. (I thought that showed sincere interest in my problem.)

Before he called me, the service manager called other Ford dealerships as I had done. He posed as a customer and received the same information I had -- the cost of repair was quoted at $200 to $250 instead of $580. However, the service manager informed me that the discrepancy lies in a piece of information on the estimate-software that all eight other Ford dealerships (and the four non-dealerships I had contacted) were overlooking. If they had scrolled further, as the service manager explained, they would have discovered an additional 1.5 hour charge for reprogramming the air bag once the clock spring was repaired. He indicated this reprogramming is unique to the T-Bird. (I thought he indicated the additional time was not required even on the sister-vehicle, the Lincoln LS.)

Thus, depending on the dealership (who's per-hour charge varies from $75 at two dealerships near me to $125 at the dealership with whom I was working), the total repair cost should have been quoted at about $485 plus the $95 for the diagnosis, which equals the $580 original estimate. He indicated that his quote was based on a discussion with the technician, who brought the additional charge to his attention before the original estimate was completed.

The service manager understood why I was upset and conceded that I probably would have been charged the lesser figure because of other dealerships' estimating mistake. He "got" the fact that the process could have looked like a pressure sale for an overpriced set of services. He apologized over and again.

Final result: the dealership will refund the extra several hundred dollars difference and give me five free full-service oil changes for my trouble and to re-establish trust. A reasonable result, I believe.

I hope my experience has been helpful to others and appreciate others' input.

[PoetAtLaw]

A friend on FordThunderbirdForum provided a door trim diagram and removal information, so I took my door apart. I discovered that the screeching sound comes from a steel cable that has become frayed. The cable moves the window up and down and scrapes when it moves over the pulley-like device. Glad I was able to identify the problem. But I shudder to think what the repair cost will be. Has anyone attempted to replace such a thing?

[George]

Poet: It's been a while since you posted. Did you get this fixed yet or attempt to do it yourself?